The Russia-Ukraine war thread

[Retro]

WARNING: this thread contains strong views by various members, so discretion is advised.

WW2 was started over less than this. Also, it involves most of Europe plus America against Russia, so this looks like it has all the makings of a world war - and the last one was horrific. We really don't need this garbage right now. Or ever.

As likely as an invasion seems, it's still not certain, so hopefully it won't come to pass.

Even if it doesn't turn into a world war, we'll all still feel it economically in our standard of living. We're already feeling the effects of Russia restricting gas supplies with skyrocketing energy prices and that's nothing compared to all-out war.

Ukraine crisis: Biden warns Russia may invade next month

Tens of thousands of Russian troops are at Ukraine's border, sparking fears of an invasion.

www.bbc.co.uk

OPINION

From everything I've seen and heard about the con job that is brexit, I've had the distinct impression that Russia is behind brexit in order to weaken Europe and the West overall. And make no mistake, it does, especially as the UK is a nuclear power with strong ties to America. Funny then that no sooner than brexit actually happens we have Russia threatening Europe, isn't it?

Finally check out A Different Bias, where Phil Moorhouse is very good at articulating the problems with brexit, the corruption of Boris Johnson and this tory government. Very good material here for countering leavers' lies and rhetoric.

https://www.youtube.com/c/ADifferentBias/videos

 

[Retro]

Now that Russia is on the brink of war, this great video explains the background to why this is happening.

 

[Retro]

And so the war begins.

Ukraine conflict: Russian forces attack from three sides

Moscow launches a deadly attack targeting cities and military targets, as civilians attempt to flee.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Retro]

Here's an interesting article on what it would (apparently) take to make Putin really sit up and take notice: go for the political elite who action Putin's instructions.

Then I read the about author section at the bottom which gave me pause for thought:

Angus Roxburgh is a former BBC Moscow correspondent and consultant to the Kremlin. He is the author of The Strongman, Vladimir Putin and the Struggle for Russia

Note the bit highlighted in bold. He either knows how to get to Putin because of his experience, or he's actually working for Putin to sow disinformation to make for ineffective measures against him. I have an uneasy feeling that it's the latter. Read the article and see what you think.

Forget the obsession with sanctions against oligarchs. I have a better way to hurt Putin

Forget the obsession with sanctions against oligarchs. I have a better way to hurt Putin. The billionaires are close to the Russian leader but he doesn’t listen to them. Hitting the elite who advise him would soon spread discontent

uk.news.yahoo.com

 

[Retro]

Just what is wrong with the American right? It's like they're all Putin shills.

Here, they're blaming everyone but Putin for Putin's war. The other day, Trump praised Putin for invading Ukraine!

Tucker Carlson leads rightwing charge to blame everyone but Putin

The Fox News host has defended the Russian leader’s invasion of Ukraine, saying ‘Has Putin ever called me a racist?’

www.theguardian.com

 

[Retro]

The invasion isn't quite the walkover that Putin had hoped. Good.

How Ukrainian defiance has derailed Putin’s plans

It’s too early to describe the Kremlin operation as a failure, but it has not succeeded yet in its mission to seize and subjugate its neighbour

www.theguardian.com

 

[Retro]

According to this article, the West's inaction and corruption has encouraged this tinpot dictator to invade Ukraine after more than 20 years of soft, useless sanctions over previous atrocities.

I believe the article is right. See what you think.

War brought Vladimir Putin to power in 1999. Now, it must bring him down | Jonathan Littell

Putin believed he could invade Ukraine because everything we failed to do over the last 22 years taught him that we are weak

www.theguardian.com

 

[Retro]

How to spot fake videos of the war.

If you're not sure about the authenticity of a video, then it's best not to share it, even if it's gone viral.

How to spot misleading stories online about Ukraine crisis

BBC Specialist Disinformation Reporter Marianna Spring has some tips on how to spot what's true and what's false.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Retro]

I think we're already at WW3 in all but name. I suspect - and dread - that full-on military conflict between East and West will break out sooner rather than later.

Read this article for an informed opinion on this situation.

Ukraine invasion: Has World War Three already started? Some security experts believe existential global conflict has begun

The West and Russia are already at war in just about every sphere except actual fighting. But is escalation into an era-defining armed conflict inevitable, asks Sky's Deborah Haynes.

news.sky.com

 

[Retro]

Well, this is interesting. Just shows the depth of feeling about Putin's despotic actions. He's now progressed to genocide by bombing hospitals full innocent sick civilians, including kids. He's a mass murderer if ever there was one.

Please stick to the forum rules here though, so no hate speech, even against our despot of the moment, Putin.

Criticism and suggestions for potential solutions are allowed though.

Facebook to allow calls for violence against Putin - BBC News

In response, Russia has called on the US to stop the "extremist activities" of parent company Meta.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Retro]

I sure hope this ex-US general is right. Putin's already caused appalling suffering, death and destruction which has scarred Ukraine for decades.

Putin will have to bring his invasion of Ukraine to a halt, says ex-US general: ‘He has no choice’

Nato officials have estimated that 40,000 Russian troops have so far been killed, captured or injured in conflict

uk.news.yahoo.com

 

[Retro]

Steven Seagal, Putin puppet?

How can any sane, rational person from the West support Putin after this horrible ongoing invasion?

Have a read and see if you think there's something weird about his support for Russia.

Steven Seagal tells Putin allies ‘I love you all’ during 70th birthday party in Moscow

‘We stand together, through thick and through thin,’ former Hollywood action star told gathering

uk.news.yahoo.com

 

[Tiffany]

One of the problems with being a novice historian is you tend to gravitate to "anything news" and it's not enough to take in that news and accept it, but you have to go further for more detail until you have the whole historical picture. I'm deeply concerned with foreign affairs. When I read the news it's almost like I've seen this movie before, like many movies I've seen that portray the internals of governments and their moving parts. The challenge is having confidence that the decision makers will dial down the foreign issue, in this case this war on Ukraine rather then inflaming it. I have studied WW1 and WW2 as much on my own as possible. So many parallels and it's terrifying. I'm praying for peace

 

[Retro]

Yes, history repeats itself doesn't it?

Of course, the thing we're all scared of is WW3 with nukes. That's a war that the human race might not recover from. Beyond awful. I really wouldn't put anything past Putin and he's already made veiled threats to use them.

 

[Tiffany]

Your country went through horrors in WW1 and WW2; a lot of precious lives lost from so many countries. America totally fails in teaching history and at present is set on re-writing it. That's another subject entirely. What amazes me is that Russia has so many Nuclear War heads and a vast capability for destruction.

The Intermediate Range Nuclear Forces Treaty was signed between Reagan and Gorbachev in 1987, however, Russia still has more nuclear warheads and in trying to piece this together, apparently Ukraine gave their nukes to Russia in 1994 through a US (Pres. Bill Clinton) , Ukraine (Pres. Leonid Kravchuk, Russia (Pres. Boris Yeltsin) trilateral agreement to denuclearize/transfer weapons but with guaranteed security, protection, financial compensation and sovereignty to Ukraine; Budapest Memorandum. There are different ranges of international agreements from treaties, conventions, accords and pacts. Since Russia, at the time agreed to protect Ukraine in exchange for their Soviet Union era nuclear war heads, I would argue, no matter what type of "agreement" was written, that Russia has defaulted and is egregious beyond words.

I will continue to pray for humanity, and the leaders of countries that there will be an end very soon to this needless assault and suffering on Ukraine. I'd like to also see some international changes made to further the safety and proliferation of nuclear capabilities for any country with nuclear power. Adding to nuclear concerns, I'm actually more concerned with EMP use as a first line attack before nuclear attack.

I agree, history repeats itself over and over, variations on the same theme, just different villains and bad actors. and now we are 100 seconds to midnight.

 

[Tiffany]

My apologies if I was a little dark. I should never post early in the morning after reading the news!

 

[Retro]

My apologies if I was a little dark. I should never post early in the morning after reading the news!

Oh no, don't worry about that. There's no requirement to only make "happy" posts. The existence of this thread is proof of this!

Lots of good factual stuff there and alas, until all tinpot dictators are excised from the world, kinda unlikely, these awful things will keep happening.

 

[Tiffany]

Thank you!! Yes, the dictators must go and the Ukrainian people need their sovereign freedom.

 

[Mars]

Unfortunately, European countries, especially Germany and France, continue to purchase their gas/oil from Russia, they pay Billions, and those billions stock up the terrible Russian war machine.
The only way to emasculate Putin is to hit him in his pocket, throw the Russian economy into turmoil, which will-Hopefully-act as a wake-up call to the Russian people; to get their head out of the sandbox and face reality.

IMHO concentrated efforts should be made to sever the dependency of countries on Russian oil and gas; but I realise that this cannot be easily achieved, and certainly not overnight.
Bloody P. knows that! I find this realization extremely painful and gloomy.

Any "agreements" with Russia, at any era, is not worth the paper it is written on.
Just consider how they fooled Ukraine, got Ukraine to surrender all their nuclear warheads back to Russia....and now look where it got them.
Shaking hands with Russia is like shaking hands with the devil: you are left holding a live grenade!

 

[Tiffany]

Agreed Mars! From an American perspective I find Germany and France's messaging confusing along with resolving the complication of gas supplies from Russia (Nord stream2).

 

[Retro]

It looks like the threat of Russian nukes is becoming ever stronger as Putin's idiotic war on Ukraine stumbles and fails. This should make everyone sit up and take notice as nuclear war will literally affect the whole planet. There's no escaping a nuclear war, either directly from the blasts, or the radioactive contamination afterwards over a wide area and its terrible effects on health. Nukes could quite literally send us back to the stone age. What a waste.

It's obvious what the West should do to stop megalomaniac madman Putin in his tracks before he pulls the trigger, which I feel he will, but I won't spell it out here.

I believe that in his tiny mind, he either wins this war, or everyone else pays the price for his loss, even if that means destroying himself and Russia. Yes, I think he's that extreme, that mad. I just hope there are enough checks and balances within his corrupt regime to prevent it, but I wouldn't bet on it with a tyrant like this leading it.

CIA Director William Burns on Thursday warned that the US can't "take lightly" the threat of Russian President Vladimir Putin using nuclear weapons in Ukraine.

"Given the potential desperation of President Putin and the Russian leadership, given the setbacks that they've faced so far, militarily, none of us can take lightly the threat posed by a potential resort to tactical nuclear weapons or low-yield nuclear weapons," Burns said in remarks at Georgia Tech in Atlanta.

CIA director warns Putin's 'desperation' over Russia's failures in Ukraine could lead him to use nukes

"None of us can take lightly the threat posed by a potential resort to tactical nuclear weapons or low-yield nuclear weapons," the CIA chief warned.

uk.yahoo.com

 

[Retro]

Just how disgusting is this? What's wrong with these people? This and the willful murders of innocent civilians is why I have no sympathy for the Russian soldiers who get killed or cought. Let them rot.

Ukraine intercepted a phone call of a Russian soldier's wife granting him permission to rape Ukrainian women: 'Just wear protection'

A woman can be heard granting her husband permission to rape Ukrainians in a phone call intercepted by Ukraine's secret service, RFE/RL reported.

uk.news.yahoo.com

 

[Tiffany]

This is disgusting on so many levels. I did not catch this in the news aggregate I use to catch updates, though I could have missed it. The news that comes in daily is overwhelming on what's happening in Ukraine, hard to catch it all. Truthfully, even hard to read some of it and see the war torn areas and what is happening to the people. Nukes or EMP's, very scary. I'm really trying hard to trust our governments to make the right decisions, along with NATO and their efforts. It's terrible!!

 

[Retro]

You're right, it's very distressing. I often only read the headlines as that's enough distressing material to read about it. However, for this story, I just had to read and share it. Unbelievable to have the soldier's wife give him permission to rape another woman under any circumstance. Just how brainwashed is she?!

To say I hate this war and the warmonger behind it, Putin, is a gross understatement.

I've just made a few science and technology posts that you might like to have a look at as a bit of light relief from all this awfulness.

 

[Tiffany]

Agreed. Sometimes I can only scan the headlines and even then, I wish I could 'un-see" the pictures.

Cool, I'll go check out your science and technology!