The Trump downfall thread

Retro

Founder
Staff Member
Joined
4 Jun 2021
Messages
5,704 (4.49/day)
Right Geffers, apologies for the delay, now I'll reply to both posts here.

Do the Democrats play political games? Yeah, sure, one gets nowhere without them, unfortunately. I'm not a big Democrat fan either, it's more about really not wanting the Republicans in power and especially Trump. I don't know if they were "friends" with Trump at the time and I don't think it makes that much difference anyway, because things move on. He wasn't a politician then and that's a huge difference.

You don't try to bury a video for 70 years if the evidence is incriminating,
Again, you refer to some mythical video without any evidence. Do you have a link to it? And again, 70 years would have been before Trump's time, he would have been just 6 years old then.

Look, if you're not gonna give me any evidence of this video, then I'm just going to ignore any further points you make based on it, because that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence, since it's completely without merit.

Another example of press bias is the Covington Catholic High School in Kentucky, the press nearly ruined a young teenager's life because he was wearing a MAGA hat. Completely false reporting by US media.

I don't know anything about that. Maybe they did and it's wrong to do it, but it doesn't negate my arguments against Trump and the reporting on him by the mainstream media outlets is pretty accurate too. One barometer of this is how much they agree on the facts, regardless of variations of amounts of detail and wording.

Yeah, the Ukraine war needs to be stopped alright - by hitting Russia harder. Tump would simply give Ukraine to Putin on a plate, as I explained. That's not "ending the war". It's total capitulation to a warmongering tyrant and that's a Very Bad Thing.

It would end up leading to more war, as he'd see that he completely got away with invading Ukraine, a peaceful neighbour, for no good reason. He'd try to build up the old Soviet Union again, end up invading other countries too and we'd end up with the mother of all wars. You know it. The nuclear issue is tricky though, I agree and is what's held back the West from squashing him like a bug, unfortunately. Remember, it's always Putin threatening the West with nukes, not the other way round.

I don't see any rebuttals from you to my arguments about Trump's misdeads and I've backed mine up with lots of evidence, too. Seriously, you need to convincingly defeat those to have a chance at winning this argument.

Now, in reply to your second post. I've numbered your posts for clarity of reply.

The odd thing is;
1 Cocaine found at Democrat White House
2 Dead body found in Garden of Democrat Obama's mansion
3 Male prostitute found at home of Democrat Nancy Pelosi's home
4 Illegal servers found at Democrat Hillary Clinton's home

Yet FBI raid Trump

Power corrupts and can come full circle, many cheered when Farage lost his bank account, are the same cheering Gina Miller's bank issues?

1 A bit of cocaine really isn't that big a deal, is it? Fact is drugs are everywhere and I'd bet my bottom dollar that people at mar-a-lago take it too.

2 The poor man drowned and it wasn't in their garden, but in the waters outside the property. Not the same thing at all.

3 A false rumour. There were quite a lot of sources reporting this one, including CNN, but I picked Snopes as it would give you less scope to just claim they're in the Democrats' pocket. Snopes have a good reputation for getting at the truth, so can be relied upon.

4 Yup, she did and that's naughty. Again though, hardly the worst thing in the world and pales into insignificance compared to what Trump's done, which I've given lots of evidence for in the above posts. It's pretty much a "so what?" argument.

So, 3/4 of your claims debunked with quick Google searches and one weak argument for the fourth one. On the other hand, Trump has committed so many serious crimes - with lots of evidence - that no wonder the FBI have raided him. They wouldn't be doing their job otherwise.


I was one of the many who cheered when Farage lost his account. The worst charlatan I've ever seen. I almost started a thread on it at the time, in fact (and the story rumbles on) but never quite got round to it. Feel free to do so if it's something you'd like to talk about. :) I'll remind everyone that he was offered a standard NatWest account though, so it's not like they left him without an account, just not the fancy millionnaire's one he'd had for something like 40 years. I can imagine just how much it must have frustrated him though. My heart bleeds.

Comparing Farage to Miller, it's interesting that when it's done to her*, it's barely reported, if at all, but when it happens to Farage, it makes front page headlines for weeks, isn't it? Why is he so special?

*More specifically, that new political party she's set up.
 

Retro

Founder
Staff Member
Joined
4 Jun 2021
Messages
5,704 (4.49/day)
Technically, he could get stuck in prison, then win the election and govern from there, or perhaps pardon himself and walk away Scot free, but this looks pretty unlikely as it's unprecedented.
 

Geffers

Linux enthusiast
Joined
1 Jul 2021
Messages
570 (0.46/day)
Right Geffers, apologies for the delay, now I'll reply to both posts here.

Do the Democrats play political games? Yeah, sure, one gets nowhere without them, unfortunately. I'm not a big Democrat fan either, it's more about really not wanting the Republicans in power and especially Trump. I don't know if they were "friends" with Trump at the time and I don't think it makes that much difference anyway, because things move on. He wasn't a politician then and that's a huge difference.


Again, you refer to some mythical video without any evidence. Do you have a link to it? And again, 70 years would have been before Trump's time, he would have been just 6 years old then.

Look, if you're not gonna give me any evidence of this video, then I'm just going to ignore any further points you make based on it, because that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence, since it's completely without merit.



I don't know anything about that. Maybe they did and it's wrong to do it, but it doesn't negate my arguments against Trump and the reporting on him by the mainstream media outlets is pretty accurate too. One barometer of this is how much they agree on the facts, regardless of variations of amounts of detail and wording.

Yeah, the Ukraine war needs to be stopped alright - by hitting Russia harder. Tump would simply give Ukraine to Putin on a plate, as I explained. That's not "ending the war". It's total capitulation to a warmongering tyrant and that's a Very Bad Thing.

It would end up leading to more war, as he'd see that he completely got away with invading Ukraine, a peaceful neighbour, for no good reason. He'd try to build up the old Soviet Union again, end up invading other countries too and we'd end up with the mother of all wars. You know it. The nuclear issue is tricky though, I agree and is what's held back the West from squashing him like a bug, unfortunately. Remember, it's always Putin threatening the West with nukes, not the other way round.

I don't see any rebuttals from you to my arguments about Trump's misdeads and I've backed mine up with lots of evidence, too. Seriously, you need to convincingly defeat those to have a chance at winning this argument.

Now, in reply to your second post. I've numbered your posts for clarity of reply.



1 A bit of cocaine really isn't that big a deal, is it? Fact is drugs are everywhere and I'd bet my bottom dollar that people at mar-a-lago take it too.

2 The poor man drowned and it wasn't in their garden, but in the waters outside the property. Not the same thing at all.

3 A false rumour. There were quite a lot of sources reporting this one, including CNN, but I picked Snopes as it would give you less scope to just claim they're in the Democrats' pocket. Snopes have a good reputation for getting at the truth, so can be relied upon.

4 Yup, she did and that's naughty. Again though, hardly the worst thing in the world and pales into insignificance compared to what Trump's done, which I've given lots of evidence for in the above posts. It's pretty much a "so what?" argument.

So, 3/4 of your claims debunked with quick Google searches and one weak argument for the fourth one. On the other hand, Trump has committed so many serious crimes - with lots of evidence - that no wonder the FBI have raided him. They wouldn't be doing their job otherwise.


I was one of the many who cheered when Farage lost his account. The worst charlatan I've ever seen. I almost started a thread on it at the time, in fact (and the story rumbles on) but never quite got round to it. Feel free to do so if it's something you'd like to talk about. :) I'll remind everyone that he was offered a standard NatWest account though, so it's not like they left him without an account, just not the fancy millionnaire's one he'd had for something like 40 years. I can imagine just how much it must have frustrated him though. My heart bleeds.

Comparing Farage to Miller, it's interesting that when it's done to her*, it's barely reported, if at all, but when it happens to Farage, it makes front page headlines for weeks, isn't it? Why is he so special?

*More specifically, that new political party she's set up.


The mythical videos you refer to relate to the security videos of Jan 6th. The Democrats referred to them at the enquiry then wanted the evidence buried for 70 years. Anything exonerating Trump was removed from view by Twitter (Fully admitted at enquiries now) and facebook as well as not reported by the media. Here is an example, in the aftermath of George Floyd riots in June 2020 a church was on fire, St Johns Church in Lafayette Park. Trump walked to the church with a Bible and made a speech. Democrats and media claimed Trump ordered police to use tear gas to clear the crowds for a 'photo op', that was LOB as the link below shows but of course many reports by bias press say otherwise.


You mention about supplying evidence and ask for rebuttals of your opinions of Trump, unfortunately media form peoples' opinions,
there is a sizable portion of the population that agree women can have a penis. In 2021 we were told the jabs were safe and effective, one jab then back to normal, that stopped CV in its tracks. Then it was a second jab, then a booster. Every day at 8pm were were told of covid deaths and how we had to comply with orders to stop this disease, well, more people and dying now in UK, US, EU, Australia, NZ and other places than during the height of the pandemic but we have press and media silence.

I didn't make any claims about the four news articles I mentioned, I merely made a comparisons in coverage and enquiries. And remember, Jeffrey Epstein committed suicide, mere coincidence the videos went out at the time of his 'suicide'. Maybe he did but he could have implicated many famous people.

As for cheering Farage losing his bank account because you don't like him, I don't like Gina Miller but I wouldn't cheer her losing facilities because her views differ from mine. Of course Farage would get the coverage, he is GB News' main presenter, lucky he was in that position otherwise the banks would still be enforcing their principles, hopefully Gina Miller will get her services back now, thanks to Farage.

People nowadays seldom alter opinions even when given evidence to show they may have been mistaken, here is a short video of students who assumed Trump said something detrimental and criticised it but when they found out the comment was made by Democrat Kamala Harris they were then defensive of the comment.

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

An article highlights a similar theme.


All I know that the World is certainly not a better place since 2020, it is hard to imagine it would have been worse under Trump and if one takes that view then chances are it would have been better.

Geffers
 

Tiffany

Web Diva
Staff Member
Joined
13 Apr 2022
Messages
2,445 (2.56/day)
I believe the latest indictments on Trump from J6 are the most concerning. The conspiracy charges will likely not stick, but I think the obstruction charges may be his most serious charge. *This is looking at this from a legal standpoint without a political lens.
 

aussiefooty

Well-known member
Joined
30 Apr 2023
Messages
294 (0.51/day)
I believe the latest indictments on Trump from J6 are the most concerning. The conspiracy charges will likely not stick, but I think the obstruction charges may be his most serious charge. *This is looking at this from a legal standpoint without a political lens.
He's in deep shit! This will harm his reputation even more so.
 

Tiffany

Web Diva
Staff Member
Joined
13 Apr 2022
Messages
2,445 (2.56/day)
He's in deep shit! This will harm his reputation even more so.

He is and it looks like his attorneys are also in trouble for conspiracy named but redacted in the document indictment though they haven't been formerly indicted yet. I'm presuming the prosecution will pursue them for information and the attorneys will save themselves rather then falling on the sword for Trump.
 

Retro

Founder
Staff Member
Joined
4 Jun 2021
Messages
5,704 (4.49/day)
Look at that, Trump is running scared from a judge who has handed down stiff sentences to Jan 6 rioters, so he's trying to change the judge to a more favourable one and also a different court. Since when does the accused get to decide how they're tried? This effort should fail.

Donald Trump has said he will ask the judge in his election fraud case to step aside on what he called "very powerful grounds".

He claimed that "there is no way I can get a fair trial" unless she does.

His call came after the prosecution requested a court order that would limit what he can publicly say about the case.

Tellingly:

He give no details of his grounds for asking her to step down.

 

Geffers

Linux enthusiast
Joined
1 Jul 2021
Messages
570 (0.46/day)
Look at that, Trump is running scared from a judge who has handed down stiff sentences to Jan 6 rioters, so he's trying to change the judge to a more favourable one and also a different court. Since when does the accused get to decide how they're tried? This effort should fail.



Tellingly:




Sadly in US now judges are often referred to as Obama appointed, Bush appointed, Trump appointed.

It should make no difference at all but political decisions are now made.

Jurors can be objected to if bias can be an issue to that should apply to judges too.

We live in a era now where evidence is not always the main issue, politics is often the motivation.

Geffers
 

Tiffany

Web Diva
Staff Member
Joined
13 Apr 2022
Messages
2,445 (2.56/day)
Sadly in US now judges are often referred to as Obama appointed, Bush appointed, Trump appointed.

It should make no difference at all but political decisions are now made.

Jurors can be objected to if bias can be an issue to that should apply to judges too.

We live in a era now where evidence is not always the main issue, politics is often the motivation.

Geffers

Agreed. The US judicial system is supposed to be fair and impartial. One shouldn't have to shop around for a judge to hopefully have a different acquittal or convictions result.
 

Retro

Founder
Staff Member
Joined
4 Jun 2021
Messages
5,704 (4.49/day)
The mythical videos you refer to relate to the security videos of Jan 6th.
Ah, right, now it makes sense, finally! :) Videos made now to allegedly be buried for 70 years - a lifetime.

I don't remember hearing anything about exonerating info being buried - and I look at many news websites - but ok, perhaps there was some of that going on. Or maybe they were just suppressing misinformation from him. I simply don't know without seeing specifics, but it seems more likely suppressing misinformation, to me.

Thing is, I've seen and heard enough audio and video evidence directly of wrongdoing by Trump reported by the mainstream media for any claims of a witchhunt against him to be total hogwash. It's common practice for a criminal to gaslight by blaming everybody else for their wrongdoing, as Trump does all the time to try and dodge the consequences of their actions.


Here's a few things off the top of my head and in no particular order:
  • I saw the Jan 6th riots live on CNN as they unfolded, including Trump's inflammatory speech beforehand. Add this to the months and years of Trump working them up and no wonder they rioted for their cult leader. Interestingly, I directly saw that Trump's staff / supporters tried hijacking the official White House YouTube channel for his speech, which kept flip flopping between his speech and a WH message about not abusing that facility for personal messages / gain. I literally had the YouTube channel playing and saw it happen live. I also saw the whole speech on the Independent's video feed, which I had running at the same time. I don't know why no mention of this has ever been made since it was a misuse of government resources for personal gain.
    • When the riot started, where were the security forces? After 10 minutes I was seriously questioning this. They showed up something like 2 hours later, because he'd refused to give the order to intervene. This alone is very, very telling of his true motives.
  • All those hundreds of classified government documents stored at his small flat* in Florida which had not been declassified first, plus that audio recording of him talking and boasting about some of them pertaining to Iran, to unauthorised people after he was out of office.
  • Trump pressuring Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger to "find" 11000+ votes so he'd win the state by just one vote. There's recorded audio of that one, played widely by the media at the time.
  • The consistent and constant lies about a "stolen election". He's lost all 60-something lawsuits relating to that. If there had been good evidence of that, he'd have won the lawsuits, a good proportion at least, and been shouting those results and the hard evidence from the rooftops. No way were all 60 cases rigged against him. Sorry, not buying it. I remember he had a conversation with a reporter, on TV, literally saying that if he won, then all fine and good, but if he lost, it was a rigged election. That's preposterous and shows his motives quite transparently right there. So, what, the country should just hand him the presidency without voting because if he loses it's rigged? That's clearly nonsense. Insane in fact.
  • The indictment regarding the hush money payment to Stormy Daniels that he pretended was a business expense.
  • That radio interview (in the UK I think) where he made some claim in the morning live on air and in the afternoon had claimed to have never said it. Of course, the audio for both were recorded which the media were quite happy to play back to back, making him look like a right tit, or more accurately, like the pathalogical liar that he is and very stupid. Something like this loses one all credibility and he's never apologised for this either, compounding it. If he's done that here, you can be sure he does it often. All he had to do is claim some memory lapse due to stress / busy schedule / other BS and he'd have more or less got away with it.

Right, I think that's enough to be going on with and it's all been posted in this thread anyway if one wanted to dig up the details, or one can just Google it for more.

The crucial thing is that you can see from the list above, that you can't put these things down to biased reporting, censorship, a witchhunt, or just opinions, especially as some of them I've witnessed directly myself from audio and video of him saying these things, so the media are simply bringing us the unvarnished facts, ie the truth like they're supposed to.

btw, I'd also watch Fox news to see the other side, but Fox disappeared from Sky a couple of years ago now and I'm not paying a subscription to watch that channel. The Fox clips I do see reported on CNN, BBC, YouTube and other places make me facepalm though.

This point is critical, so I'm putting it in bold: I don't understand how you can see the same factual things about Trump that I and many others do, along with his constant divisive rhetoric and yet still side with him that he's being persecuted and that the election was "stolen" from him. It's clearly untrue.



I can't stand Farage, what a con artist he is, who successfully foisted brexit on the UK with extensive manipulation and perhaps funding from Russia. I don't care how unfairly he's been treated by Coutts and it does look like he has been. For the broader picture, banks shouldn't do this, but I'm just glad at anything that stitches him up. Alas, he's been offered his account back by the new boss since in a furious backpedal. Don't know if he's accepted though, but I can't see him refusing his snob account that he's had for 40 years.


You mention about supplying evidence and ask for rebuttals of your opinions of Trump, unfortunately media form peoples' opinions,
there is a sizable portion of the population that agree women can have a penis.
Yup, people are gullible fools en masse unfortunately and women certainly cannot have a willie.

In 2021 we were told the jabs were safe and effective, one jab then back to normal, that stopped CV in its tracks.
I don't remember hearing this claim. They always said it reduces the damage from covid and people remain infectious, not stops it in its tracks.

Agreed that Epstein was most likely murdered - and I'll even go a step further and say that I suspect Trump may have given the order, since they were buddies and hence the scandal would have rubbed off on Trump.

Remember, there's creepy recorded audio (video?) of Trump saying he'd date his daughter if she wasn't his daughter, so what's the chance that he's a paedo too? No evidence has come to light so far, but perhaps it might have if Epstein had been allowed to blab in court, which would have sunk Trump for sure. This is one thing that no one can recover from, so best to just kill off the threat, eh?

*Satire




Sadly in US now judges are often referred to as Obama appointed, Bush appointed, Trump appointed.

It should make no difference at all but political decisions are now made.

Jurors can be objected to if bias can be an issue to that should apply to judges too.

We live in a era now where evidence is not always the main issue, politics is often the motivation.

Geffers

Yeah, I'm with you on this one, up to a point. American politicians are sponsored by and work closely with, rich and powerful lobbyists, eg oil industry, who fund them and it's all open and above board, too. This is something that's not officially allowed in the UK, which is good, but happens anyway under the radar, resulting in scandals when they're found out.

Thing is, the evidence is so strong against Trump, that even full-on Republican judges will have to find against him, simply no choice, as will juries as has already happened in some previous lawsuits, I think relating to the "stolen" election.
 

Retro

Founder
Staff Member
Joined
4 Jun 2021
Messages
5,704 (4.49/day)
Just look at the crazy nut jobs who support Trump. If this isn't a massive indication that Trump's not fit for office, then I don't know what is. Trump is a messianic cult leader to these people.

Anyway, this one's now safely dead, shot by the FBI, loads more to go.

 

Retro

Founder
Staff Member
Joined
4 Jun 2021
Messages
5,704 (4.49/day)
Finally someone is addressing the elephant in the room: that Trump could still run for office while convicted and in prison, a totally ridiculous state of affairs. Compare that with the UK, where someone with a criminal record can never be a police officer, a waaay lower position of power and is as it should be.

However, a couple of conservative law professors reckon he's already disqualified himself. Note that they're conservative, not democrat, that's important. This is great news and would mean that regardless of his popularity he'll never be able to be president again, which would be a disaster for America and the world.

Donald Trump should be disqualified from serving as president under Section Three of the 14th Amendment to the US Constitution, according to a new paper published by two conservative law professors.

William Baude and Michael Stokes Paulsen argue for their interpretation that the 14th Amendment contains a clause that any former elected official who engages in insurrection or rebellion is prohibited from holding office in the future.

Participating in an insurrection is exactly what Mr Trump stands accused of doing, both by the US Department of Justice and by various members of Congress.

 

Retro

Founder
Staff Member
Joined
4 Jun 2021
Messages
5,704 (4.49/day)
It's like taking a toy from a schoolchild when they should be doing homework. I'd be mortified if they said I couldn't have my smartphone. And all because Trump can't be trusted not to misuse it. What a facepalmer lol.

The federal judge overseeing the DOJ's January 6 case against former President Donald Trump ruled that he can't have his phone with him while reviewing documents in the case to keep him from copying evidence.

Prosecutors at a hearing Friday pointed out that the former president has a "tendency to desire to hold onto material he knows he should not have."

 

Retro

Founder
Staff Member
Joined
4 Jun 2021
Messages
5,704 (4.49/day)
@Geffers you were thinking that the mainstream media won't report on investigations surrounding Biden and his family, instead just focusing on Trump "unfairly", due to bias against him and also that investigations tend to be suppresed.

Allow this article on Hunter Biden's investigation to allay your fears. :)

 

Tiffany

Web Diva
Staff Member
Joined
13 Apr 2022
Messages
2,445 (2.56/day)
@Geffers you were thinking that the mainstream media won't report on investigations surrounding Biden and his family, instead just focusing on Trump "unfairly", due to bias against him and also that investigations tend to be suppresed.

Allow this article on Hunter Biden's investigation to allay your fears. :)


Davis Weiss will have to prove he's not a Yes Man and honestly investigate Hunter Biden IMHO.

Merrick Garland has elevated the status of David Weiss, the federal prosecutor who has already filed criminal charges in the case.
 

Retro

Founder
Staff Member
Joined
4 Jun 2021
Messages
5,704 (4.49/day)
So now, Trump's been indicted for a fourth time, this time for trying to overturn the election in Georgia by "finding" 11780 votes. I remember when I heard that phone call, I knew that he'd be nailed for it, it was just so blatant.

This article nicely summarizes all four indictments which have been lobbed at him so far. He must be feeling really stressed over them, as he should be. I really can't see him walking away from this.

 

Tiffany

Web Diva
Staff Member
Joined
13 Apr 2022
Messages
2,445 (2.56/day)
Good article! Wow all trial dates starting in January of 2024 through May of 2024.
 

Retro

Founder
Staff Member
Joined
4 Jun 2021
Messages
5,704 (4.49/day)
Trump's got such a big headache on his hands, lol:

Running for president of the US is an arduous task even in the best of times.

Seeking the White House while facing multiple indictments and the prospect of multiple civil and criminal trials is an almost unimaginable task. That, however, is the reality that Donald Trump currently confronts.

 

Retro

Founder
Staff Member
Joined
4 Jun 2021
Messages
5,704 (4.49/day)
Just look at how Trump is floundering trying to extricate himself from these criminal charges. He's bang to rights and he knows it.

First, his legal team thinks he shouldn't do the "big reveal". Oh, please, do the big reveal!

This one's just hilarious as the photo turns out to be from his own presidency! :ROFLMAO:
 

Retro

Founder
Staff Member
Joined
4 Jun 2021
Messages
5,704 (4.49/day)
Now Trump wants Fox News stop using this unflattering photo of him. Yeah, I'd hate that one too if it was me, lol.

Donald Trump has hit out at his once beloved Fox News for using unflattering photos of him, including one of him looking “orange” and with his “chin pulled back”.

Oh dear.


Trump big orange.jpg

 

Geffers

Linux enthusiast
Joined
1 Jul 2021
Messages
570 (0.46/day)
Trump supporters are as big scumbags as he is.

Can't wait for him to rot in jail and at least some of his cronies too. Drain the swamp, indeed.

That is a totally unfair comment. My girlfriend in US is a Trump supporter, you have never met her and regard her as a scumbag, totally out of order.

Geffers
 

Geffers

Linux enthusiast
Joined
1 Jul 2021
Messages
570 (0.46/day)
One has to remember with the Biden administration, whatever you think of religion Biden and Nancy Pelosi are Catholics, they both support abortion up to the third trimester. Babies have been aborted but delivered alive and left to die (also in Australia). They have also allowed trans women (men) into womens sport and agree that women can have a penis. If you believe what they say then maybe naive.

Geffers
 
Back
Top Bottom