The Trump thread

[Astro What]

@Astro What please open your mind to the possibility of it having been rigged. There's too much evidence to not be suspicious at this point. Hopefully, one day the smoking gun will hopefully emerge and hopefully before it's too late to do anything about it.

Just because there are ways to get in does not equate to it happening.
Otherwise, by that argument then you have to say every computer in the world is currently hacked because there are weaknesses in design that can be exploited, ergo they must be hacked.
It's rather hard to hack into something remotely if it's never hooked up to allow remote access other than under controlled conditions.
And those machines aren't just left stored in a closet at the end of a never travelled hall and not monitored in most jurisdictions. The VERY few that they aren't monitored do not encompass enough votes to turn an election.
Hell, even in my podunk county the machines are kept locked up using a biometric lock system, the door is on an alarm that sounds (and logs) any time it is opened and there are video cameras monitoring the outside door and the room itself from 2 of the 4 corners, and that video is stored onsite and off-site and there are only a few that have access to the video software.

The majority of the arguments being used are simply tie-dyed versions of what Trump and Company tried to use when he lost.
Anything is possible to happen. But if one wants to make claims that it impacted something, you need evidence... which is sorely lacking, both in the arguments being used to try to defend the Democrats loss just like it was when it was used to try to defend Trump's loss.
There is a phrase that covers that philosophy.. Woulda, Shoulda, Coulda.

From actually talking with people and watching the number of yard signs and stuff in my area, I have no doubt that there are a LOT of gullible folks that bought into the BS that Trump was selling hook, line and sinker and voted for him. You can see a lot of those that did so now being vocal because the BS he sold about the Epstein files are turning out to have been just one more thing he manipulated them on along with the Medicaid issue (which will impact a LARGE number of folks that voted for him).
There are a LOT more gullible folks in this world now than there used to be. Hell, I know several left leaning Independents that voted for him because they were tired of what I detail in the next paragraph.

The Democrats (specifically Biden) did themselves ZERO favors when they kept hidden the issues that Biden were having and tried to play him off as perfectly fine when even the slowest in the electorate could tell he was on a decline. They then waited to the last minute to jump onto another train... and sadly it did not have enough time to gain any velocity because they jumped on the most convenient one (Harris) instead of actually finding the best one (an open nomination process).
As far as elections go, it was the perfect storm for Trump and it is what got him back into office. Voters were leery of the Democratic Party because of the way they worked so hard to hide the issue(s) that were present with Biden. Meanwhile, Trump, even though being a proven liar, was lying to folks faces and making it believable.

The funny thing is... the right brought out there "expurts" trying to prove the same thing... and many of them used similar arguments. Now that the shoe is on the other foot, the left is trying to "explain" away their loss while ignoring the VERY large elephant in the room, which I pointed out above.
If you look closely at voting tendencies world-wide, the conservatives in many areas gained ground in areas you would not expect that to happen. There is a reason for that. And the main reason is, the other party has begun to swing to far to the left instead of concentrating on staying as near to the middle as they can. Political extremism has become the norm on both sides of the aisle.
In some of the more recent elections in which conservatives did not gain, it is frequently being pointed as an Anti-Trump Bump being what protected them.

That video brings nothing new to the table other than a rewash of many arguments the right tried to use to explain away their loss... and if they especially especially trying to use Trump's ramblings it is problematic. We all know he rambles. We all know he makes crap up. We all know he spews that made up crap to the world. Even Trump knows he does it, but tries to divert from what it shows by giving it a name like the "weave". Yes... there are some VERY intelligent folks that their conversations will wander like that. But the statements they make during their "weave" are easy to see as being based upon fact or strong evidence.
Trump would easily be shown in ANY legal trial to be an unreliable source for the truth if he ever was placed on the stand. And he is WELL aware of that... it's why in all his trials he has gone through he has refused to get on the stand. Hell, even in many of his depositions he has been shown to have been untruthful at the worst and disingenuous in most other substantiative responses.

 

[Retro]

Alright, I see you remain as unconvinced as ever, sigh. Alas, I don't have personal knowledge of these systems and how they're handled to properly counter what you're saying and bolster the hacking argument. I only have the info from the news and videos like this one. There's still just too much evidence from credible sources of foul play here to ignore. Add to this, the things that Trump has said and done, what Musk said and the way Trump won all 7 swing states on such tight margins that something really stinks here. I wanna stress that I'm not saying it's a certainty, but it's in the high 80s and even 90-something percent that it's been rigged in my opinion.

I'd love to see your reaction if they do ever find that smoking gun.

Podunk - had to look that up and I like it. Learned a new word today.

From Oxford Languages via Google:

a hypothetical small town regarded as typically dull or insignificant.

 

[Astro What]

I only have the info from the news and videos like this one.

And that was the argument used by those pushing he Trump "stolen election" beliefs.

There's still just too much evidence from credible sources of foul play here to ignore.

So said those that pushed the Trump "stolen election" story line.

The simplest answer is usually the correct answer. Folks got tired of the BS that the Democratic Party was feeding and they did a poor job of pushing where they were doing good. Then they had the hiding of Biden's health issues to fold into the mix when it was readily apparent that he was in decline and they tried to hide that fact.
Sadly... to start that election process off you had two very poor candidates. And you had one that had great messaging and the other got caught out. And by the time that party (the Democrats) finally acknowledged they had a major issue it was too late in the process to "paint" the alternative choice they selected in a very positive light.

 

[Retro]

And that was the argument used by those pushing he Trump "stolen election" beliefs.

So said those that pushed the Trump "stolen election" story line.

So what? That doesn't stop our side from using similar arguments when they're the truth. Dems fearing getting accused of the same arguments as a supposed invalidator is what Trump has relied on and it's worked, too. Again the difference is that Trump lied while the Dems told the truth.

btw, did you watch this latest video? I appreciate it was 28 minutes long so took some investment in time, but you need to have seen it to properly understand the arguments in it. And no, they don't need to be especially different to what's gone before, because the truth doesn't change, does it? Just keep banging that drum and produce more and more evidence to show it's true. Remember those credible sources that were in it which make all the difference.

So, how would you react if they did find that smoking gun? I'd really like to know.

As far as two bad candidates, Trump certainly was, but he somehow has that cult power to form that MAGA cult which one can't deny, unfortunately. For the Dems however, I reckon if Biden had been the same as in 2020 he'd have won again, perhaps by an even bigger margin. It was seriously unfortunate that age cought up with him and he declined just as the election was getting under way and it was so obvious throughout and to the point that the debate was a disaster. They should have replaced him near the start or never let him run (which they couldn't directly do, either), but that's easy to say with hindsight. They were between a rock and a hard place.

Again, it boils down to the electorate being blind to the conman insurrectionist criminal that Trump is and making it a close election (that it really was close I have no doubt, or they couldn't have pulled off that rigging without it being really obvious). Why could the likes of me and you see right through him, but not so many others? It was there for all to see, plus Biden had made a lot of genuine achievements and there were enough liberal media to point out the constant lies that Trump spewed out. So, Biden wasn't in his prime and age was catching up to him, that's no reason to vote for a conman insurrectionist criminal rather than the competition, whoever that was and whatever state they were in. But people are stupid like that, which enabled this to happen. No, Kamala won a close election and this time, it really was stolen.

 

[Astro What]

That doesn't stop our side from using similar arguments when they're the truth.

Whose "truth"?
There is the same amount of evidence to prove these claims as there was for those from Trump and his cronies.

I reckon if Biden had been the same as in 2020 he'd have won again

Very likely.. but the issue was he wasn't. And it was readily apparent to anyone watching him that he wasn't, yet the idiots in the Democratic party continued to push a fantasy that he was. Voters did NOT like that.

which they couldn't directly do, either)

Yes... they could have. That's why there is a nominating process... but they didn't want to go through that because, in hindsight, it would probably have actually shown the issues that Biden was having if he had to deal with others competing against him and him having to debate them.

Why could the likes of me and you see right through him, but not so many others?

The lesser of two evils theory. And several of my friends that voted for him pretty much stated that. They felt that even Harris was too radical in her position. Many of them would have voted for a more moderate Democrat.

No, Kamala won a close election and this time, it really was stolen.

No, she didn't. In fact, in 2024 I didn't vote for EITHER candidate because I did not feel that either Harris or Trump were qualified.
But I did vote for down-ticket candidates.
Of course, either losing side would probably look at my voting submission and then try to claim that the "machine cheated me" since I DID vote down-ticket but there was no vote for the Presidential candidate. And the only reason for that is that there was not a "Neither one since they are both poor choices" box to check.

 

[AllThingsTech]

Hackers gather at a conference every August to discover vulnerabilities in the US voting machines. Here’s last year’s results of August 2024:

https://www.politico.com/news/2024/08/12/hackers-vulnerabilities-voting-machines-elections-00173668

Let’s see what the results are next month. While the revelation that vulnerabilities found take a long time to get fixed could provide fodder for those questioning the outcome, a hack that would disrupt an election is unlikely. With that said, who knows, especially when a poll is tight?

In spite of said vulnerabilities, here is why voting machines are difficult to hack:

• Lack of internet access to voting machines
• Storage in secure locations with access limited to election officials, leading up to election day and after cast of votes
• Constant surveillance at polling stations, with training to election officials and security personnel to ensure no unauthorised access is possible
• System largely based on paper ballots

Election fact check: How voting machines work and why they're hard to hack

While election officials use technology for voter registration, tallying and in some cases vote-casting, the system is largely centered around paper ballots.

abcnews.go.com

Of course there are always insider threats and corruption present, as is the risk within any company with employees held in a position of trust. However, election officials have been held accountable for tampering with voting machines

 

[Astro What]

Of course there are always insider threats and corruption present, as is the risk within any company with employees held in a position of trust. However, election officials have been held accountable for tampering with voting machines

Yep.. Peters out of Colorado immediately comes to mind. And it seems that most of the ones that have been prosecuted were Trump followers.

 

[Retro]

@Astro What ok, we'll have to agree to differ on the election rigging. I'd hoped that this video might make you reconsider, at least to some degree, but no, not happening. nvm this is just a casual conversation.

I see we agree on some points however, so that's something.

Yes... they could have. That's why there is a nominating process... but they didn't want to go through that because, in hindsight, it would probably have actually shown the issues that Biden was having if he had to deal with others competing against him and him having to debate them.

That's what I was referring to. They can't just say "not you, him" and be done with it. Democracy I guess, lol.

 

[Retro]

Now that his own MAGA base are turning against him, I get the feeling that Trump might not get out of this one and might finally be his downfall. Good, can't come soon enough.

I feel so betrayed and so angry. This is not what I voted for.” “This cemented permanent deep state power.” “I’m concerned about being able to trust Donald Trump to keep his word.” “What about justice for these young ladies who were trafficked? What about their justice? Don’t they deserve justice?”

These were just a few of the calls that besieged conservative radio hosts across the US this week. The president’s ardent supporters spent the past decade fulminating over various foes, from Barack Obama and the deep state to undocumented immigrants and transgender children. Now they have a new target: Donald Trump himself.

The “Make America Great Again” (Maga) base is in revolt as never before. The trigger was Trump’s broken promise to publicly release details about Jeffrey Epstein, a wealthy financier and convicted sex offender, who was facing federal charges of sex-trafficking minors when he died in jail in 2019.

‘The ghost of Epstein is haunting Trump’s presidency’: inside the ‘Maga’ revolt

As pressure builds over the president’s broken promise to publicly release details about the convicted sex offender, his base has a new target: Trump himself

www.theguardian.com